Kire-Kitsune wrote: Gottfried wrote:Oh man, Gears is still the greatest half epic ever. Square should forever be ashamed of pulling the plug on that game, to force them to work on the game whos success would end up comdemning an entire genre to de-evolution and marginalization. I still remember how Excited I was to put in that second disc, to continue the, pulse racing adventure where everything has finally come together, and gotten soooo exciting.... And then being stuck in a chair... Disc 2 was basically proto saga. Look, dont touch.
Most Blade fans I know are old gears fans who were pretty dissapointed with the change in direction of saga. Gone was the ahead of its time level/world design, gone was exploring nooks and crannies, and rotating the camera to see the obstacle course you had to navigate to get to those chests. Gone as well was the vast overworld to explore... And no overworld is a huge screeching deal breaker for me.
The focus on melodrama over plot didnt sit well with us either, nor did sitting through hours and hours of cutscenes focusing on jiggling boobs and panty flashes, ie namcobandai's marketing signature, and sagas entire and only merchandise legacy.
Saga was a pretty huge shift in style from the games the team key future monolithsoft members had previously worked on, from ff6, to chrono trigger, to Xenogears- Xenogears was a snes design style rpg, evolved to the next level with the advanced technology, Saga was more in line with the emerging 'design' style we hated, the cutscene heavy, exploration nuetered, interaction restricted games, that played like bad commador rpg's using the power of the system to simply display really pretty backdrops and pre rendered movies- the staple of Squares Pre-rendered rpg era, and the design philosophy they still use today, even though they dont need to pre render anymore. (We'll see if FFXV trying to ape xenoblade manages to get them out of this rut. I doubt it, I get the strong feeling its mostly on rails, extremely restrictive in its 'freedom' and full of context sensitive BS, basically a theme park ride shallowly depicting the things its promising)
On top of that, a lot of us strongly dislike the franchise because it was completely ruined from its original vision from a meddling smut peddling publisher, nearly destroyed monolithsoft, and nearly drove one of the best writers in RPG history to suicide, and after that, pretty much kept her from ever wanting to write for games again, at least credited, which is an incredible, terrible loss.
Xenoblade was a return to form to the styles of games the members worked on before saga, and before the psx era 'de-evolution' of game design.
While I agree that Gears was a more mechanically sound game and Namco's reign was deplorable, I must say that I do not mind the style of RPG that Saga took on. There is a level of enjoyment for me to be had in games of that kind, titles such as Final Fantasy X and Baten Kaitos. Xenosaga Episode 1, for instance, features a well composed, startegic evolution of Gears's combat system. This makes up the bulk of Saga's gameplay and it is suitably entertaining. There is a charm to focusing on mastering a battle system, setting your strategies into play (Which even went pre-battle, luring enemies into traps to further success in battle) and being rewarded with an addicting storyline. (For me at least) It brings to mind shades of Legend of Legaia and Grandia, two RPG's that feature some of my all time favorite combat systems.
Even Gears featured a slightly limited form of interaction with it's environment, there being so few items to examine. While I loved the lateral movement, platforming and such, (Which brings pleasant memories of Wild Arms with it) it was a bit sad that I couldn't fiddle with my environment and get a text box here or an interactive piece of the environment a'la Grandia there.
As I said however, there is a charm to limiting the forms of gameplay to simplify one's interaction. There felt like a more cohesive whole to the battling in Episode 1 that often felt more like a chore in Gears at times. (Though I enjoy it's combat quite a bit. And running around in a Gear is more fun than it has any right to be, lol)
Blade, on the other hand, has none of this. Xenoblade is actually one of the more hideously complex RPG's I've played. Any one system is simple and breezy to use, yes, but there are so many systems to take into account. The arts, Skills and Linking them, Collectaepedia, Gem creation, Inventory management, Affinity Chart...and they all weave together to aid your abilities in battle. It's a beautiful web. They all require you to interact with the gameworld in each way, sidequesting, fighting, item collection, exploration-it all forms a single cohesive connection to the gameworld through useful, necessary gameplay systems. This creates a genuine link between me, the game world and the characters in it. It's really quite remarkable when you disect it like that, and it's why I hold the game in such high esteem.
Pushing a button and passively reading something describing something you should already be able to see is not interaction, it is the opposite of interaction. Books, are not interactive. WHile it can be interesting, and great for world/lore building, making it an important part to an immersive world lore (And something saga does very well), it is not interaction, which is active, it is passive. The simple ability to jump and actually navigate terrain on the players own terms, using the rule set layed out, makes gears infinitely more interactive with the world/level design, than say, simply pressing a button to go from one heavily restricted plane to another heavily restricted plane, thats called context sensitive actions, where you stand in a certain spot and press a button, and a series of events occurs, like climbing up a ladder, or jumping up boxes to get somewhere, yet its automatic and out of player control. Context sensitive actions can streamline a lot of unnecessary or mundane things, but when they start replacing main traversal mechanics, it becomes context sensitive garbage. Context sensitive garbage is NOT interaction, its a shortcut used by devs who dont know how, or dont have time, or just dont care, to actually program or design, an actual interactive system, and the design and vast quantity more testing to the world to make it worth utilizing. Because of this, Gears is a very 3d game via its environment, it really couldnt be done in 2d. Xenosaga, is a very 2d game, it can, and in fact, WAS converted to a 2d game.
Xenoblade takes a much more interactive role in world building/lore building than Saga, rather than say, reading about the giants in a lengthy log, the player goes on a series of events, collecting artifacts, and clues along the way, leading them to multiple tombs, which eventually leads them to a hidden giants tomb in one of the first areas, where they explore and discover what happened to the giants.
Saga didnt really have an evolved form of gears combat system. Saga was a pretty standard take on the active time battle system Makoto Shimamoto created earlier in FF, with some nice additions like boosts, and only cosmetic similarities to gears, such as the ability to call in A.G.W.S and to chain attacks using action points. While these are cosmetically similar to things done in gears, they are fundamentally different from a design perspective, which is why saga had a far more interesting battle system than gears. I think most people will agree Sagas battle system was more engaging than what gears used. Gears battle was cool and flashy, and well animated, but that was about it. The extent anyone really needed to do was use buttons enough times to unlock the most powerful deathblows and spam them. Gear combat was more interesting, but thats not saying much. The evolution of the combat used in gears can be seen in titles like project X zone. Gears wasnt really enjoyed by many that I know of for its combat system, particularly before the game opens up, many people will agree certain slogging sections definately made the combat seem like a chore. Saga 1 had pretty average jrpg combat, saga 2 was god awful, and 3 was pretty dang good (a running theme in 3, it is faaaaaaaar better than the other entries)... For standard jrpg battle systems.
But they were all de-evolutions of Mr. Shimamoto's work in chrono triggers battle system, like most of Squares psx output was, these games had the players in a straight line on one side, and the enemies in a straight line on the other side. In chrono trigger the player placements were unique in each battle, which affected the strategy of what moves to use, as moves were tied to an area of effect, either around the player, in a straight line from the player to the enemy, in a cone in front of the player etc: On top of this, enemies actually moved, further adding a layer of strategy of what moves to use and when. Blade is the continuation of this system, adding the ability for the player party to move as well, streamlining mundane actions like normal attacks, to the player simply choosing to be close enough to be in range, and applying the active time system to each individual move as well as normal attacks, which was a god send in allowing the player to greatly speed up the length of battles, as was not having to load between battle arenas and the world map.